Somali pirates say they will fight commando raid

[IamKeenan]

:lol:This is such a joke. When a Commando unit goes it these pud wanna be warriors will end up as toast:lol:


MOGADISHU, Somalia (AP) — Somali pirates on a hijacked cargo ship holding battle tanks and hostages said Thursday that they were ready to battle any commando-style rescue attempt.

The warning came a day after the Somali government gave foreign powers a blank check for using force against the pirates, while U.S. warships continued to circle nearby and a Russian frigate headed toward the standoff.

"Anyone who tries to attack us or deceive us will face bad repercussions," the pirates' spokesman, Sugule Ali, told The Associated Press by satellite telephone from the Ukrainian ship MV Faina.

Ali sounded calm and relaxed despite being surrounded by a half dozen U.S. Navy vessels and buzzed by American helicopters.

Navy officials decline to comment on the possible use of force, but they warn the pirates against harming the 20 crew members or trying to unload the ship's cargo of 33 Soviet-designed T-72 tanks and other weapons. They make clear they won't allow the arms to fall into the hands of an al-Qaida-linked Islamic movement that is battling Somalia's government.

Ali said the pirates planned to release the ship with crew and cargo intact after receiving the $20 million ransom they have demanded. They seized it Sept. 25 and are no anchored off the coast of central Somalia.

"We have nothing to do with insurgents or terrorist organizations. We only need money," he said. "We would never reduce the ransom."

The Faina's hijacking, the most high-profile this year, illustrates the ability of a handful of pirates from a failed state to menace a key international shipping lane despite the deployment of warships by global powers.

A proposed U.N. resolution took aim at high-seas lawlessness. The French-drafted plan calls on all countries with a stake in maritime safety to send ships and aircraft to fight piracy off Somalia, according to a draft obtained Thursday by The Associated Press.

Ali specifically warned against the type of raids carried out twice this year by French commandos to recover hijacked vessels. The French used night vision goggles and helicopters in operations that killed or captured several pirates, who are now standing trial in Paris.

Russia, whose warship was not expected for several days, has used commando tactics to end several hostage situations on its own soil, but dozens of hostages have died in those efforts.

The Faina standoff will probably be resolved with a ransom payment like nearly 30 other hijackings this year, said Roger Middleton, who published a report on Somali piracy for a London-based think tank, Chatham House, on Thursday.

But the negotiations might drag on, he said.

"In some of these instances pirates have held out for almost two months," Middleton told the AP. "They know how to wait things out. I think the likeliest conclusion to this, and the swiftest, is the payment of ransom. The alternative for the shipping company and the international community is that the ship is sunk and her crew die."

Hijackings of this Horn of Africa nation are being conducted with increasing sophistication by pirates equipped with rocket-propelled grenades, satellite phones and global positioning systems.

Middleton estimated they have already pulled in up to $30 million in ransoms this year.

A Danish intelligence company specializing in maritime security said Thursday that Somali pirates make an average of $1 million per hijacked vessel and hold ships for an average of five weeks before freeing them.

On Wednesday, the Somali government authorized foreign powers to use whatever force is necessary to free the Faina.

The new proposed U.N. resolution to fight piracy was expected to be put to a vote in the Security Council early next week. It expands on resolutions passed by the council earlier this year giving permission to nations to send warships into Somalia's territorial waters to stop piracy and armed robbery at sea.

But foreign warships in the area have not deterred piracy off Africa's longest coastline. On Thursday, the Bahrain-based spokesman of the U.S. 5th Fleet, Lt. Nathan Christensen, said the Navy received reports of three more failed attacks on shipping in the Gulf of Aden.

Middleton said the risk of hijackings threatened to further drive up prices for the oil and other goods being shipped to Europe and America from the Middle East. He said insurance rates for vessels traveling by Somalia had jumped tenfold.

Associated Press writers Barbara Surk in Dubai, United Arab Emirates, Pauline Jelinek in Washington and Katharine Houreld, Anita Powell and Tom Odula in Nairobi, Kenya, contributed to this report.

[IamKeenan]

U.S. targets Somali pirates


Yahoo! Buzz Digg Newsvine Reddit FacebookWhat's this?By Donna Leinwand, USA TODAY
The U.S. and international military forces are taking more aggressive action off the African coast as bolder and more violent pirates imperil oil shipments and other trade.
The area is a key shipping route for cargo transported to and from the U.S. and elsewhere. In response to pirate attacks, the U.S. has stepped up its patrols to deter them and sometimes intervened to rescue hostages and ships. It also has increased its intelligence-sharing in the area, says Navy Lt. Nate Christensen, a spokesman for the 5th Fleet in Bahrain, which patrols Middle Eastern and African waters.

The U.S. is "very concerned about the increasing number of acts of piracy and armed robbery" off the Somali coast, he says. Somalia's weak government has admitted it can't control its territorial waters, and Nigeria is fending off a rebel group.

A U.N. Security Council resolution, pushed by the U.S. and passed June 2, allows the U.S. and its coalition allies to intervene by "all necessary means" for the next six months to stop piracy off the Somali coast. Coalition ships have since scared off pirates in at least two attacks, says the London-based International Maritime Bureau.

African coastlines have surpassed Asian shipping lanes as the most dangerous in the world. Hijackings and hostage takings are increasing off the coasts of Somalia in the east and Nigeria in the west. The Asian straits, particularly Indonesia, held the top spot for most of the past decade.

Piracy in Nigeria is leading to a drop in oil shipments because shipping companies are reluctant to risk ships, cargos and crew, he says. "That has implications for U.S. strategic energy supplies."

African waters account for 56% of all pirate attacks, spiking from 27 attacks in the first half of 2005 to 64 attacks since January. Meanwhile, pirate attacks elsewhere are dropping, reports the Piracy Reporting Center, a Malaysian-based group that monitors attacks for the bureau.

The attacks are more violent than in Asia, says bureau manager Cyrus Mody. Pirates near Somalia, the Gulf of Aden, Nigeria and Tanzania took 172 hostages in the first half of the year.

Somali pirates armed with automatic weapons and rocket-propelled grenades regularly hijack ships and hold crews for ransom.

The Lourdes Tide, a supply ship working for a U.S. company, was attacked in Nigeria on May 13 by armed pirates who demanded a ransom. Pirates released the vessel and 11-person crew June 16.

The United Nations' World Food Program has requested military escorts to get its ships carrying 32,000 tons of food each month into Somalia, where civil strife and drought have worsened the food crisis. A Dutch frigate ended its escort mission in June, says Peter Smerdon, the group's spokesman in Africa.

Ships alter course by hundreds of miles and expend as much as a day's supply of fuel to avoid Somali pirates, says Michael Livanos, president of Scio Shipping, based in New York. "The costs are gigantic," he says.

The bold pirate attacks along the African coast come as attacks decline in a key Asian shipping lane.

The U.S. military says it donated equipment, coordinated joint training exercises and nudged Indonesia to cooperate with its two maritime neighbors, Singapore and Malaysia. It wanted the three countries to get control of the Strait of Malacca, an important waterway for oil shipments, cargo and cruise ships.

"It's as critical a chunk of water as exists anywhere in the world," says Adm. Timothy Keating, commander of the U.S. Pacific Command.

Their efforts seem to be working. Ships sailing near Indonesia reported 13 attacks between Jan. 1 and June 30, down from 64 in the first six months of 2003 — an 80% drop, according to the Maritime Bureau's half-yearly report. Ships reported two attacks in the Malacca Strait so far this year.

The U.S. bolstered Indonesia's Coast Guard and Navy with 15 high-speed patrol boats and seven radar units. It trained with navies from all three countries and persuaded them to share intelligence about ships passing through international and territorial waters. Malaysia coordinated a joint air patrol with neighboring countries to surveil the waterway.

"If it wasn't safe to bring cargo through the Strait of Malacca, the U.S. Navy would go there and make it safe," says Vice Adm. Doug Crowder, who commands the U.S. 7th Fleet, based in Japan. Crowder says the cooperation now makes that unnecessary.

That same formula is unlikely to work in Africa. "If you were to try to call the leader of Somalia and ask to come for a visit, who do you call?" Keating says.

[Voobrazheniye]

The pirates must have boats to operate with and, therefore, must have bases to operate from. It should not be that hard to figure out where these are.

Why not have a nice, live-fire, joint naval exercise by the United States and Russia using these worthless pirates and their bases as targets? Here is at least one area where perhaps the two countries could cooperate - and have some fun in the process.

[IamKeenan]

The pirates must have boats to operate with and, therefore, must have bases to operate from. It should not be that hard to figure out where these are.

Why not have a nice, live-fire, joint naval exercise by the United States and Russia using these worthless pirates and their bases as targets? Here is at least one area where perhaps the two countries could cooperate - and have some fun in the process.


And besides I always heard that Burned Pirate was pretty good to feed famers pigs:lol::yo:

[Lucker]

Aren't there about 17 Ukrainians aboard ?
Guess that's the only reason they have not blown them to smithereens .
And the cargo costs a lot of money .Collectors would pay good money for those clockwork tanks .

[saprosky]

French strategy was very good in the past. Let's escape hijackers and then attack them in his own territory.

Some guys will be happy to shot all his ammunition (Spain is a poor country and can't spend money on it :becky: )

[IamKeenan]

Aren't there about 17 Ukrainians aboard ?
Guess that's the only reason they have not blown them to smithereens .
And the cargo costs a lot of money .Collectors would pay good money for those clockwork tanks .


Lets get the Ukrainains off and then blow it to hell just to send a message:yo:

[Lucker]

Lets get the Ukrainains off and then blow it to hell just to send a message:yo:

And how is Mc Cain Tubby going to do that ?
Hostages with guns up their bums tend to do as they are told ,smart arse !!!!!!!!!!

[IamKeenan]

And how is Mc Cain Tubby going to do that ?
Hostages with guns up their bums tend to do as they are told ,smart arse !!!!!!!!!!

Figure it out you TOOL!! have you ever heard of the words ''Commando'' and ''Raid?''

[Shadow-off]

Ladies & Gentlemen I have the perfect soultion. Right rudder that Trillion dollar submarine and call general quaters. Ready the torpedo room and load tubes 1 & 4. Sink her where she sits. Then the crew and the teriorists will be forced to swim, the armorment threating the world will be useless, Russia and the Ukraine will be able to file and insurance claim with Loyds of London, makeing more profit and the ecosystem will inherit a new artificial reef. Sport divers will love it too. I think it's a lovely plan. :becky: :l_diver::croc:

[Lonewolf74]

Ladies & Gentlemen I have the perfect soultion. Right rudder that Trillion dollar submarine and call general quaters. Ready the torpedo room and load tubes 1 & 4. Sink her where she sits. Then the crew and the teriorists will be forced to swim, the armorment threating the world will be useless, Russia and the Ukraine will be able to file and insurance claim with Loyds of London, makeing more profit and the ecosystem will inherit a new artificial reef. Sport divers will love it too. I think it's a lovely plan. :becky: :l_diver::croc:


It sure is interesting but:

1- Torpedoes besides opening big holes in ships also kill people. Thats not exactly good news for the hostages.

2- By simply sinking that ship fuel will be spilled and you never know what else the ship was tranporting or if any special ammo is aboard. So much for the natural reef (interesting idea though).

@Keenan

Hmmm Rambo V?


Its a lot easier to pay the ransom...get the hostages and then send in the troops to blow them pirates apart and get the money back. :p

[Lucker]

Shatow,
At least your plan has the merit of employing more than one brain cell .
As a profiler I am now seeing a high probability that General Tubby is moving from dangerous to lunatic and if he starts taking an interest in a High School Campus , I fear the worst .
They will roll him over and kick him to death

[Voobrazheniye]

At least your plan has the merit of employing more than one brain cell .


True... two is more than one. Not much more, but more.

[beezneesman]

I guess all this militaristic masturbation helps to take the rednecks minds off the credit crunch but the military reality is that there are currently around 250 foreign merchant seamen being held hostage in this region of Somalia. A purely military solution would appear to be unrealistic unless you want to see a lot of claret being spilled (much of it entirely innocent).

So chairborne commandos which one of you wants to give the good news to the grieving relatives?

[IamKeenan]

I guess all this militaristic masturbation helps to take the rednecks minds off the credit crunch but the military reality is that there are currently around 250 foreign merchant seamen being held hostage in this region of Somalia. A purely military solution would appear to be unrealistic unless you want to see a lot of claret being spilled (much of it entirely innocent).

So chairborne commandos which one of you wants to give the good news to the grieving relatives?

And another lifechanging post by the sneezeman:cheer2:

[beezneesman]

And another lifechanging post by the sneezeman:cheer2:

So I'm guessing you don't intend to be the first off the ramp then?:rolleyes:

[Shadow-off]

I know we are diplomatic, and if I were a hostage I would hope for diplomatic resolution. Unfortunatley the worst thing to do in dealing with terriorists is to negotiate with them and as long as we will do there will always be terrorism. If no one ever negotiated with terriorists it wouldn't exist because they only do what is successful and what works for them. They play on our humanity in an attempt to achieve an objective. There are only two choices; take them out and put the hostages at risk or immediately give in to their demands in hopes it will be enough to save life.

The process of negotiation is expensive. Russian ships, U.S. Navy ships and other countries and their ships and man power locked up in a huge money drain with every day that passes.

[Lucker]

I do not claim to be a Negotiations expert , but it was my belief that this route produced the best results .
We appear to have a very sophisticated approach and understanding because I cannot think of where we have failed to reach a good result in the last twenty years .
We are never a push over and , as far as I am aware , we give nothing away but do it cleverly .
If pushed , as in the killing of a Policewoman and subsequent siege , we blow them to bits once options disappear .
Even where we make a regrettable mistake ( no negotiations ) --- the Brazilian lad --- we blow them away . Admittedly this incident was straightforward in comparison to the Pirates situation .

[beezneesman]

I know we are diplomatic, and if I were a hostage I would hope for diplomatic resolution. Unfortunatley the worst thing to do in dealing with terriorists is to negotiate with them and as long as we will do there will always be terrorism. If no one ever negotiated with terriorists it wouldn't exist because they only do what is successful and what works for them. They play on our humanity in an attempt to achieve an objective. There are only two choices; take them out and put the hostages at risk or immediately give in to their demands in hopes it will be enough to save life.

The process of negotiation is expensive. Russian ships, U.S. Navy ships and other countries and their ships and man power locked up in a huge money drain with every day that passes.

The reality is that all governments negotiate with terrorists from time to time (including yours and mine). A major complicating factor here is that 250+ hostages are being held by different pirate groups so many different nations with different attitudes are inevitably going to be involved.

By the way - these guys in Somalia seem to be pirates not terrorists (at least not terrorists in the Al Qaeda/jihadist sense which is what I assume you mean't). It would appear to me that simply sticking the label 'terrorist' on anyone and everyone there is an issue with at any time is a dangerous oversimplification.

Jihadist terrorists and pirates (who were mostly local fishermen previously) will of course have different objectives and will probably require different approaches with differing proportions of 'carrot and stick.'

[Voobrazheniye]

Terrorists are in it for the glory of Allah, which they hope will bring them paradise and their 72 virgins.

Pirates are in it for the money, which which they might hope to buy something a little closer to paradise than what they already have, and with which they can buy 72 (or so) slightly used virgins. :lol:

[IamKeenan]

I would like to see a few ''Stings'' in which we dangle the golden carrot for them to approch, and then blow them away. And maybe when they see body parts floating onto their beach they will think twice about boarding another ship. :plane:

[beezneesman]

I would like to see a few ''Stings'' in which we dangle the golden carrot for them to approch, and then blow them away. And maybe when they see body parts floating onto their beach they will think twice about boarding another ship. :plane:

I don't suppose it ever occurred to you that these people might not be stupid! :rolleyes:

[IamKeenan]

I don't suppose it ever occurred to you that these people might not be stupid! :rolleyes:

Sure they are!!Haven't you ever heard that Greed overpowers all? Why do you think there is so much crime--GREED!!! And these Idiots are not any different

[beezneesman]

Sure they are!!Haven't you ever heard that Greed overpowers all? Why do you think there is so much crime--GREED!!! And these Idiots are not any different


LOL looks like you've talked yourself into a job there chief :lol::lol:

Relax everyone Keenan's 'the man with the plan'
:rolleyes:

[Lucker]

It's people like old Tubs that make you think that they get what they deserve --- Palin ,Mc Cain , Bush , Guns , burgers , piss Beers , pidgin English , poor rock bands , Cola , American TV , rounders ( Base ball ) , Men's net ball ( Basket Ball ), Jerry Lewis , Huey Lewis , anybody else called Lewis , California , Crocodiles , Texas and lots of very fat friends who shoot defenceless animals . May be Russia aint so bad .

[kentuckydan]

I don't suppose it ever occurred to you that these people might not be stupid! :rolleyes:

The technique is called a Q ship.

I believe the Royal Navy used the technique during both the First and Second World Wars

[beezneesman]

The technique is called a Q ship.

I believe the Royal Navy used the technique during both the First and Second World Wars

But Keenan seems to think they'll keep falling for it :lol:
Read his post